Steve Latham wrote:
> "Joey Goldstein" <nospam@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> news:fp9td7$kgr$2@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> One of the things I've always been able to do when using the old C-Lab
>> Notator, Emagic Logic and Apple Logic Express software for
>> notation/composition, is to time ****ft short (or longer) passages of
>> music to the left or to the right *in time* by simply dragging the
notes
>> to the left or right.
>> With Logic, you first set an overall increment of 1/4s, 1/8s, 1/16s or
>> whatever, then select the note content with the mouse and drag
>> the notes to their new location in the time flow.
>>
>> I've got an old copy of Sibelius 3 running on my Mac and I've been
>> mucking about with it lately trying to see if something similar is
>> possible, and it doesn't look like it is. Dragging a note or notes
>> simply moves its placement on the page but not its metrical position.
>> In order to move the notes' metrical position I have to use Cut and
Paste.
>>
>> Am I missing something?
>> Is there a simpler way to do what I need to in Sibelius?
>> Is Sibelius 5 any better for this type of thing than Sibelius 3?
>
> Being for notation, and not playback, you can't really "drag and drop" a
> note to a new metric position. Partly this has to do with the way they
keep
> calculating and updating the correct number of beats in a measure
(because
> typically you've already selected a note value - though you're right,
> sequencing software seems to do this without a problem - other than
strange
> ties, dots, and triplets all over the place!).
>
> In Finale (and I assume Sib), you might think of each element as a
"place
> holder" and in order for you to put something in "place 2" (let's say
the
> second quarter note), you need to have something in "place 1" first. In
the
> old days, Finale wouldn't finish off a measure for you (fill in the
rests to
> fill the "places" you didn't put notes in) but now if you exit the
measure
> with the Speedy Entry tool, it will "fill in" those places with rests
> automatically - so it must be constantly calculating on the fly based on
the
> note values you've selected.
>
> I think you're thinking of something more like the Graph/Piano Roll
editors
> in most sequencing software that will allow you to simply drag a
note/MIDI
> event to a new location - even across barlines. See, it doesn't matter
there
> because you're dealing with pure length in time. And even in their
notation
> windows (I've used Cubase's), they'll let you go across barlines and
beats
> and such, but not being designed for notation, it usually gives you
> notationally insane results. But in notation programs, they're
constantly
> having to deal with the barline as a physical stopping pont (but I
admit,
> this would be a sweet feature - drag a whole note from beat 1 to beat 3
and
> it automatically puts a half rest at the beginning of the measure and
ties
> it across the barline!).
>
> In Finale, there's a way around this. You can use the mass mover tool
and in
> the edit menu tell it to select partial measures. Then you can choose
> whether you want to copy and replace (which will write over existing
notes)
> or copy and insert (which will move things after the insert point down
as
> many beats as you've inserted). When you select partial measures, you
select
> a beat or a division, so in 4/4, rather than selecting the entire
measure,
> you can select 1, 2, or 3 beats, 4 of course, and even 5, 6, 7, etc. To
get
> 8th notes though you'd have to change your 4/4 meter to 8/8 (which you
could
> do, but tell it to display 4/4, so no one's the wiser). All you do is
drag
> your selected beats to the destination point (the only drawback is that
you
> can't drag into your selection - in other words, you can't select 3
beats,
> and drag it down one beat later - you have to go "outside" of your
selection
> range - so if you want to move something one beat, you can only select
one
> beat's worth of time :-( ).
>
> I don't know if Sibelius has a similar feature. Finale has had Copy and
> Insert or Copy and Replace (and you can even choose which elements you
> replace!) for as long as I can remember. The select partial measures is
a
> more recent addition, but long enough ago that I bet the majority of
users
> out there don't remember it not being there. Sibelius, being so
> feature-similar in many respects may have incor****ated a similar
feature.
>
> By the way, being able to move notes horizontally bu just dragging is
also
> somewhat new in Finale (comparatively) and boy was that a wonderful
> inclusion - you used to have to go in and do a lot of editing just to
move
> notes around. They simplified it immensely - and then they included the
> ability to do rests as well, thank God.
>
> In a pinch Joey, you could always ex****t to a sequencer, do the
adjustments,
> and then re-im****t back in. Or maybe Sib 4 or 5 has added the feature if
3
> doesn't already have it (and you haven't tried this work-around yet).
>
> Best,
> Steve
>
>
OK. Thanks. That's what I thought.
Being able to do this is such an im****tant facet of my poor
compositional technique that I guess I'll just continue doing my writing
in Logic and ****t it over to Finale (or Sib) when Logic's scoring
limitations come into play.
--
Joey Goldstein
<http://www.joeygoldstein.com>
<http://homepage.mac.com/josephgoldstein/AudioClips/audio.htm>
joegold AT sympatico DOT ca
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